Introduction : [00:00:00] Welcome to the wellness search podcast with Dr.Adeola Oke. Each week we discuss our wellness journey with real people like you and me. We have conversations about food, fitness, mental health, financial wellness, and much more so you can get back to the real you. To make sure that you’re up to date with this and other wellness topics visit wellnesssurge.com. Information presented here is for educational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose or treat any disease. Please do not apply any of the information presented here without first speaking with your primary care provider. Now let’s head onto the show.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:00:36] Welcome to the wellness podcast. I am your host, Dr. Adeola Oke. And I have with me Zarinah Nadir Esquire.

Today, we are going to be talking about:. Failure to plan for the inevitable may cause heartache. That’s that’s our discussion today. Alrighty. So say hello.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:00:53] Hello, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:00:56] Awesome. So Zarinah Nadir is a licensed attorney, a criminal justice professor, and a community activist in Phoenix, Arizona. Her current practice focuses on access to justice. She presents nationwide on navigating Islamic marital and inheritance law within the American legal system. Her book called Legally Savvy is due out at the end of a year. I’m so looking forward to that one, I hope we have the audio book version.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:01:27] That’s phase two.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:01:28] Okay. Awesome. So we are so honored to have her here with us today. She is a pretty- you can see from all she’s doin- I don’t know when she has time to even talk to people like me, but it’s all good. Okay. So we’re talking about, failiure to plan for the inevitable may cause heartache, right?

So what is the inevitable.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:01:49] Well, I’m honored to be here and I definitely would make time for you for your audience. And for the subject matter, this, the inevitable are the is life, right? The inevitable is life. The inevitable is realizing that, you know, bad things happen to good people. And that we also all have a date on the clock.

We don’t know what it is, but we all have a start and we all have a finish. What we all know as the nature of this life. And so, um, that’s, that’s for certain. And so when we aren’t even cognizant of that, or putting anything in place in order for those who we leave behind to have an easier road so that we’re not making things difficult for them, then we’ve failed. We fail to plan.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:02:28] Mm mm. Mm. So those we leave behind. If we’d not make plans for them, we fail to plan. Wow. Alright. So. When should people start planning? We all  know we have to deal with the inevitable, when should we start planning for this?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:02:43] Well, that’s a great question. Yesterday! That’s my favorite answer. But if we didn’t plan for it yesterday, then we, we want to plan for it today.

Uh, and it’s very important because, you know, we just have no idea. And especially, I think this climate that we’re living in right now, it’s. Especially heightened our sense of awareness of mortality and, uh, you know, that things aren’t certain. So, you know, today is the day. We have no idea what tomorrow was going to bring.

And, and, and it’s really key to be able to put measures in place. There are legal measures that are important to put in place. You know, I know that, you know, wherever you are around the world, it’s important to think about just kind of culturally what those expectations are. Perhaps religiously, what those expectations are.

Um, but every land also has a law  in place as well. And some of those laws may be completely in alignment with your own religious or cultural beliefs. But they might -in certain places – they might not be in alignment, but they’re still maybe tools for you to put in  place exactly what you would want to happen.

So, you know, just speaking kind of for the United States, for example, we have tools here that allow you to uphold your religious rules, right? This is a nation that is separation of church and state kind of nation. And so the rules and what we have, they’re called interstate rules. That is say, for example, you die without a will.

That’s what interstate means. And there are laws in place. But those laws certainly are not typically the kind of thing that you would want, whether you were Muslim, likely if you were Christian, as well or even a non-faith. These are likely not necessarily what you would want. And so we have tools in place.

There’s a tool called, known as the last will and testament, or even the trust. Uh, these are legal tools that allow you to indicate to rights typically. Okay. Well, according to my faith, and you might not have to say according to my faith. And I recommend everyone consult  with an attorney  within your state -specifically within your country, first and foremost within your state- about the particular rules for these kinds of documents within that area.

But you can write down “It’s important for me that my daughters get XYZ. My sons get XYZ. My spouse gets XYZ. My religious center gets  XYZ. Um, you know, do you think that, you know, if you pass away, especially the United States, those of us who live here, that they would make a donation -I’m Muslim, right- to the mosque, of course not.

Right. But I would care about something like that or to my favorite religious school or my favorite program like that, would they do that? Of course not, but they would if I put something in place and I made sure that it was executed properly and effectively. Um, not only that, it’s also important to keep in mind that, um, it’s not just about:”Hey, I’m going to pass away.”

I like to talk about four primary documents when we are getting ready. You know, when we’re preparing for the inevitable, one of those documents is the will. And that is where you once you’ve passed away. Everyone knows. (For example) Okay Zarina’s favorite scarves are going to go here.

Her, her Michael Jackson collection is going to go there. Right? Things like that. But there’s also a document known as powers of attorney. And those kick into place before you pass away, like long before you pass away. Some of us have to use powers of attorney while we’re you know, we’re not even near passing away.

They have to do with giving someone the authority to make certain decisions for you. In the U S we have two types of them. One is called a, uh, power of attorney for your medical directive. And then the other one is a financial power of attorney or a kind of a general power of attorney as well. So that’s going to give someone the ability to make financial decisions for you if you’re not able to make them for yourself. But keep in mind that has nothing to do, even with I’m going to die. What if you’re abroad? We know so many people right now who are stuck in a country, they were visiting over the winter break and they were never able to get back home, but they still have bills to pay. You know, a lot of this can be done online, but there’s certain things that can’t certain things you have to put a voice to, you have to call to. Did you authorize anyone? Did you put anybody in place who would be able to make those decisions so that your issues don’t end up in a shambles? We had a young lady who she was ill and she fell into a coma. Thank God she came out of it. So she didn’t pass away. She didn’t need the will.

But what she didn’t have, which what she did need was a power of attorney for her financial matters. So her rent was never paid. Her utilities were never paid. So when she got out, she was left shambles, her life was left in a shamble. So that’s why it’s so key to really think about what what’s going to happen when I’m here, not here, or I’m not able to make certain decisions for myself. What can I put in place? And what do I need to put in place? So that -again, it’s not necessarily just about you-  we’re not leaving a big, a mess, a struggle  for our loved ones. Those of us who maybe have children, we may say, I have an adult child they’re over 18, but there are now they’re left to make mom decisions and dad decisions because we didn’t make those kinds of just, you know, we didn’t put that in place.

Those who are single and they don’t have any gives, you definitely need to put something in place because once you turn. 18 specifically for the United States. In check with, you know, that kind of age of majority with wherever you are. But typically speaking once you’re the age of majority, which is 18 in the United States, your mommy can’t just make decisions for you anymore, even though she, you know, you might want her to.

So we have students going off to college and they have medical issues that happen, but they never put anything in place. A mommy can’t show up to college and say, can you tell me what their record is? I need to make sure that they get their homework. I need to know how they’re doing in class. If they didn’t authorize you to have those conversations and to speak on their behalf, the door is locked. You can’t of course, if we think about it,  it’s for their protection for their privacy.  What if someone showed up and said, I’m their mom and I’m not there were mom. Right? So we can see the, the wisdom behind some of these laws. But again, that’s why it’s important for us to plan plan for the inevitable, having these kinds of documentation in place, um, really helps you to not be scared, but just to feel prepared.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:08:41] Wow. Wow. Wow. That let me think in so many directions.

Okay. Cause I’m like, okay. Like a lot of people don’t like to have this conversation, it’s just like people just like. One day, one day, one day. If my husband didn’t forced me to go get one…. I was just like one day I’ll do it, one day, it was always one day. But when is one day, one day maybe too late. And now I’m thinking my daughter may be going off to college.

Soon. We have to have that in place because just listening to you, we always think, Oh, the elderly, the elderly, but no. It looks like 18 and above who needs it, right? What’s the age? What age do you think? Do you suggest?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:09:18] Absolutely. By the time you reached the age of majority, wherever you are in the world and the U S it’s 18, um, you want to have these, these kinds of things in place.

So what I would say is don’t wait until you’re 18, like start looking at it. When they’re 17. Okay. These are the kinds of things that we need to start making sure that they’re prepared for. I remember when I was 17, I was able to, I got registered to vote because I was in school and in high school and I was in my government class and they said, you’re going to be 18 by the next election. It’s time for you to put your paperwork in now.

So that’s, these are the kinds of thinking that we need to have so that we kind of elevate our, our legal, I like to say legal savviness. Right ? my goal is to help us all kind of just elevate that so that when our kids are going away, when we’re interacting within this world, um, you know, where we’re not being put at a disadvantage simply because we were ignorant to these kinds of information.

So, and, and as we know, when we look at the news every night, it’s not somebody who was on their way to hospice who got into a car accident. It’s the young mom. Who turned away for a second. And she got into that car accident. It’s the college kids who were having a good time altogether leaving, um, you know, heading off to spring break and they were going to the beach.

This is what happens. This is the world that we live in. Sure. We don’t want to think about it. And culturally, I know there’s some cultures who, you know, have these kind of, um, um, perspectives sometimes even superstitions about a, if I’m talking about death, you know, that means I’m. I’m going to die. Or sometimes parents feel like when their kids bring it up, if their kids want them to pass away.

But you know, that’s a, you’re a doctor and we know that’s not how death works. Um, I’m not the doctor here you are. Right. So, no, that’s not how it death, how death works or how calamity works and how tragedy works. Right. Um, it it’s, it’s a promise for all of us. Um, there’s a philosopher who said the same wind blows on us all.

And we’re all going to have the same wind blowing on us. But those of us who are prepared, we’re the ones who are going to feel more prepared, um, you know, to reduce the anxiety. Not  only for ourselves, but also for our, our friends r family and those who care, you know, care about us. I have a colleague who her mother passed away about a year ago.

Her mom’s about the same age as my mom. So, you know, not, not old at all, but she ended up contracting cancer and, um, just a beautiful, smart, intelligent, wonderful woman. And her daughter was able to say, mom left everything in place. So we knew, you know, the longterm care was paid for the will was already done.

The powers of attorney were already done. So we were just left to grieve. We weren’t left to hustle and figure out who do we call? What do we do? And who’s going to pay for this and doing a GoFundMe me account, right. To pay for things and, you know, putting your dignity out there like that. I mean, those are to do it.

You know, most of us can’t afford. Any kind of major medical calamity, but, but again, there’s certain things that we could have in place, ideally, so that we’re not doing car washes, we’re not doing passing the hat, you know, for certain things that likely could have been taken care of. If we just can we just stop for a minute and plan for it and I say, make it kind of fun.

Um, that’s kinda something I like to do. Make it kind of like a game. My family one Sunday, we all sat around and we had our. Will questionnaires, we got from our law firm. And well, you know, we’ve kind of just sat around the table, eating some good food and, you know, kind of laughing and joking with each other.

I’m like, who’s going to take care of my Michael Jackson posters. I was like, who’s going to take care of my, you know, my sneakers, you know, I mean, you know, we made it kind of lighthearted, but I’ll, I’ll tell you what, once we all got it done, it was my parents, my brother and myself, and, you know, we just felt so much better and I’ve had it updated since then, you know, an out of date will.

It can be just as bad as no will at all. Because again, in most, in most places, again- I’m generalizing of course, speak with the, you know, the attorneys in your community about what your specific rules are and how it specifically applies to you and your family and your situation. But, uh, you know, we’ve seen situations where there have been, uh, disillusions, a couple has gotten divorced, but they still listed the ex spouse as the one who was responsible for their estate. And they’re like, that’s the one I would, you know, I would never want them to be responsible for my estate. Sometimes we leave people in charge who, you know, they’re the ones who, and as a bit of a serious note, they’re the ones who put you in the hospital. And now they’re the ones who have the right to pull the plug on you, right? So these are important things to have in place. And to just be aware of coming from a family law, juvenille law background. Um, I always recommend, you know, especially somebody going through a divorce, separation, something like that. Hey, get these kinds of. Get these documents in place because you don’t want to inadvertently leave these important decisions out to somebody who really, uh, and care about you has their own, you know, hidden agendas is about you.

Um, so you know, so that’s one thing in addition to the youth, You know, young people, we want to make sure that they have a leg up. Um, parents. Uh, you want to make sure that, you know, you’re not in a situation where you’re still trying to help your kids, but they’re not, you’re not authorized to, but now they can’t speak for themselves.

And in this COVID era, people are getting hit with a sickness so quickly, and we all know in most places we can’t even go into the hospital. So say for example, and having these kinds of documents, plus you have to be of sound mind. And body so, and notary is not going to notarize it. If they’re seeing you’re not lucid, right?

If you’re in and out, they’re not, they can’t notarize it. A good attorney is not gonna be able to prepare those kinds of documents where you have to do it now while you’re healthy, while you’re feeling good. As we know, people are going into hospitals now, and we can’t even go in and say, mom signed this that’s visitors aren’t even allowed in hospital right now.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:14:58] Yes. Yes. They are not!

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:14:59] It’s so key to be able to just. Plan now. Plan today. And there’s some great resources out there and maybe we can get to them. Yeah.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:15:07] And  I think thinking about this just gets you grounded. Right? We all don’t want to think about it. Let’s be honest here. It’s inevatable right. And it gets you grounded even for the teenagers.

Like my daughter, doesn’t like to talk about death. But it’s a conversation we need to have. Right. Like if you talk about it, you have to then think about certain things you’re doing to make sure you’re okay. You know? And so, yeah, I think it’s a conversation worth having with everybody. I never thought about  teenagers and stuff. But you know, it’s never….now I know.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:15:38] Maybe we can also shifted a bit that it’s just not about just death, but it’s about what if you’re not able for yourself?

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:15:45] Yes.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:15:46] Fill in, you know, maybe we can kind of shift the shift, the conversation a bit in that way, shift the narrative. That it’s, if you’re not able to act for yourself, who would you want to do it?

Would you want mom to still do it? Would you want dad to do it? Would you want your sister, brother, best friend- who’s a nurse-right? I mean, these are, these are all the different options that we have. Do you want the government to make that decision? That’s a big answer that most of us would say no.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:16:08] Absolutely no!

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:16:08] So if they’re, if you don’t want them to make the decision, you need to make that decision. You need to make that call. What are the other big things in the U S is the will is the only legal document. You can name a guardian for your children in the event that the parents pass away. So that’s children under the age of 18.

So what ends up happening is: if you don’t make a will and designate who you want to be, the guardian for your children, the judge… a judge makes that decision. Who doesn’t know you, who doesn’t know your child, who doesn’t know even that handshake agreement you have with that friend that you’d rather take care of your child.

Then maybe some relatives, let’s all be real. We have some relatively who we wouldn’t want our kids – our kids to be with while we’re alive and with them let alone when we’re not here. So it’s very key to say, and to put these kinds of things, just plan, be prepared. And, um, for the most part, you don’t have to think about it daily.

You do it once. Um, and you know, there are certain major occasions when you want to update this kind of information in the event of a new marriage, a new death, a new divorce, a new baby, a new expansion in your business, you move to a new environment like a new state or country. Of course. Absolutely.

You’re going to want to have, you know, get these documents in place that are going to apply and be enforceable within your new jurisdiction. Right. Um, so most of the times you don’t want to think about it, but that doesn’t happen every day. So you get these documents in place and you just start feeling good.

You know, you pretty much have it done and you’ll update it here and there as time goes on.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:17:33] Okay. Alrighty. So what actionable steps? So this is the kind of like a trick question, right? What actually will steps can people actually do to start planning, right? Like, yes. I’m glad I finally know what inevitable means.

You have to make it fun, especially for those teenagers. So yes, we have to be real. So what actionable steps can people take?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:17:55] Wonderful. Well, I would say step number one: seek out an estate planning attorney within your area. You know, some accessing them through the traditional route. Some of you may have a legal plan program where you are so seek out the estate planning attorney within that area. And most of the time they have a great questionnaire. Any estate planning attorney going to have a questionnaire, and that is going to have all the information on there that you’re going to need to basically just say: Yes! No!

It gives you guidance on how compile all of your accounts if you have any life insurance policies. So that’s what you’re really going to want to do. You’re going to want to kind of put together your whole package. Some of them are even really current in the sense that they’ll ask who’s gonna control your social media if you’re not able to control it. Um, right. Who’s going to take care of Fluffy, you know, your cat. Or, your favorite pet, , if you’re not able to take care of them. So. They have that in the questionnaire. And so you’re going to be able to kind of do, do that, pull it all together.

And, um, and then, um, you know, ideally go prepare that for you. Certainly there are certain places where you might be able to do that on your own. I don’t recommend it in the United states. One: because we have so many different scenarios. Right? Sure. We’re all people, a lot of us have families, but once size really doesn’t fit all.

And so that’s why it’s key to be able to kind of have that conversation with an attorney. Um, and it doesn’t have to be, it doesn’t have to cost me if you, if you know where to look. So, you know, uh, ask around, I would say, and I’m sure somebody would be able to connect you to an incredible resource on that.

Um, but also think about your bank accounts. Um, do you have  anybody listed. I sit on there as a beneficiary. If you have any life insurance who is listed on the beneficiary, make sure that’s updated. Um, think about putting together a binder with all of that information and put it in a safe place. Of course, I wouldn’t suggest a safe deposit box because oftentimes that safe deposit box has to have the document that’s in the safe deposit box to give you access to open it.

So you don’t likely have it somewhere in the house. Safe, of course. And there you’ll have, you know, the, your will, um, you’ll have your policies. So I’ll have your account information. You want to just make it as seamless as possible for someone to be able to help you. Because if we have delay in helping you, so say if this saves an illness. The person who’s designated as a power of attorney, they can make decisions as to give you a blood transfusion, or don’t give you a blood transfusion.

Um, you can follow through on that surgery or don’t follow through on that surgery. So you don’t want any delay in your care.  You don’t want any delay in being able to have the doctors, um, help you and operate on you, but somebody has to make these kinds of calls. And so that’s why it’s really key to kind of have all that in place.

And so you do not have a delay in your care.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:20:41] Okay. So when you talk about estate planning attorney I’m like, um, okay. It’s just not going to cost.Like seriously, those words they are intimidating kind of for people that are not as familiar with the legal system. I was, I usually, I was never like a lawyer person. I just thought this is just really expensive. But I found a more affordable way to be able to afford a lawyer. Right. Um, so for some people in the United States, right. Mainly United States. Right? So what other are there like simple ways that don’t seem as intimidating as, um, ways we can get like access to lawyers that can help us with will planning and other things?

Absolutely.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:21:23] There are, um, we have them in the U S they’re called legal plans. That’s kind of generally how they’re called. Um, and that’s the ability to have a pay a low monthly fee. And now you have access to a whole law firm kind of like, Hey, a low monthly fee and you have access to a whole gym, network or you have access to a whole bunch of movies…

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:21:40] Even health insurance, right?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:21:41] Exactly. Or like health insurance. Now you have access to doctors and healthcare. So we have that kind of concept here. It’s in Canada, the U S, UK as well.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:21:50] The U.K?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:21:51] Yes. Yeah, just expanded. Um, so this is something that, you know, um, It’s it’s really an incredible way because you don’t have to know what kind of lawyer you need.

You basically now have access to this firm and you’re able to just say simply, I’m looking at  planning for the inevitable, what are the kinds of things that I need to keep in mind? And they’ll have the appropriate attorney it’s known as a state planning attorney, but they’ll have the appropriate attorney reach out to you, um, very quickly also.

And, um, to help you get that in place. Traditionally, if you go outside of that kind of legal plan route, you’re looking at, uh, at least on average, a thousand bucks. Per person, a thousand dollars per person we’re talking U S. But, um, you know, I, I imagine attorneys throughout the country are probably relatively the same as far as costs.

Um, and, uh, because it’s an, it’s an expensive profession and it’s a profession, that’s there for people to understand all of these intricacies of life. So it’s, it’s not a, it’s not a simple kind of profession. Um, it is complex. And so there are costs involved, but. The legal plan concept. Um, it’s extremely manageable.

That’s what I do. I’ve done that. And I’ve got the ability to, um, have my will update it a couple of times because I didn’t have to pay that main sticker price. I just have my little monthly fee. So, um, you know, if that’s going to be available in your area and, um, you know, I’m happy to put my contact information as well for if you want some additional information about that.

To look at as a resource.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:23:15] Absolutely. Yeah, because when my husband first talked about estate planning, I was like gosh, man. And he went through and we had the legal plan, but we were not smart enough to use it. Yeah.

So we went to this other guy, and he charged us what you just said an arm and a leg. Right. And then later on

talking to talking to other people that are also like you, and I think your mom. I  was like Oh, we have this plan. They can do this for us. Have a cheaper price. Are you kidding me? So. If you have a plan, please be smart enough to use it. Okay. No what it entails. Because sometimes some jobs, they just offer you those things and you just sign for it and then you don’t really think that, Oh, you just think, Oh, if I need a lawyer, but yes.

Things like estate planning, they will help you with it too. So I was jut like just, gosh man, how much money did we waste.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:24:05] I don’t blame you for it. You know, this, most of us have not had experience utilizing attorneys so that, you know, that’s a very normal reaction. I commend you for going anyway. Right. You were working on that and getting it in place anyway.

But yeah, most of us don’t come from backgrounds where our parents all sat together and said, let’s get these documents in place. Um, you know, this is how we were able to have, you know, make sure our legal rights are in place. You know, because the system has been just so cost prohibitive. Most of us just really thinking about using attorneys, if somebody is being arrested.

Right. And we’re like, otherwise I don’t use a lawyer. Won’t be of our society. This is why they’re wealthy. Right. This is why they’re wealthy because they’ve had the access to sound legal advice. Right. In addition to other, you know, financial advice, well, one of the key components is having legal access.

So when we elevate our knowledge and elevate our exposure to this kind of information. It’s only going to trickle down. The benefits are going to start trickling down to our kids, our families, but also our communities. Because the other thing about planning for the inevitable is that there’s so many of us who aren’t passing anything else down.

And even those ones who might say. I don’t have anything to leave. I mean, what’s the point. But whatever you have, your next generation is going to start out with it, rather than it just being, going, going back to the government. Right. Or going to certain fees because we just didn’t put this document in place.

So whatever we have, let’s give our next generation that leg up. Hey, even if it was $20, this $20, they didn’t have. And maybe they can donate it in your name or even just kind of build upon it. But this, these are also key pieces. This is a legacy. This is a societal, um, matter that we all really need to get on board because the more members of our different communities who are, who are getting savvy about this and really putting in place the ways to kind of pass along our wealth. It’s just going to make our community stronger. Just the way that the wealthy, this is how they’ve been doing it for years. And that’s why the playing field has been just so uneven all this time.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:26:08] Good information, right? Seriously  I’ve gotten a lot of information from this. So thank you so much for your time.

So we’ve talked a lot today, right? But what is one thing you want to make sure that if people didn’t even learn anything from you and I’ve learned a ton, right? What is one thing you want to make sure they take away from today’s discussion?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:26:27] Well, if you fail to plan, the plan is you’re going to fail.

So think about a planning. Plan for the inevitable. Plan for the time when you are not going to be able to make decisions for yourself. You know, none of us are Superman and superwoman. You know, we have. Terms like, you know, magic and all of a sudden, no, we’re human beings. I’m afraid to say that she’s like, I’m not, I’m not black girl magic.

I’m a human. And so we don’t have magic, but we have to plan because if we fail to plan, then you basically plan to fail. And also know that, you know, it’s not about, it’s not about dying. It’s about just not being prepared for that. We’re not scared.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:27:08] Yeah. And not causing heartache, right. For the people you love, like causing a lot of stress for them.

So thank you. Um, Zarinah um, how can people get ahold of you if you would like to find out more about like this right. Planning for the inevitable and even like more affordable lawyer services, right.

Yes, that’s important. I love lawyers now. I love lawyers now. Gosh, now that I know how to get them for cheap.

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:27:36] Yeah. I’m so happy to hear that because we love being counselors. Really not just adversarial. We love to help you. Um, so that’s great. So yeah, actually to reach me, you can reach me through D R. A N E E SA H@hotmail.com. That is my partner’s email. And, uh, you can definitely reach us there. So draneesah@hotmail.com.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:28:00] Okay. Alrighty. So that email is good for like legal services questions about that.?

Zarinah Nadir, Esq: [00:28:06] You can get to me that way.

Dr. Adeola Oke: [00:28:08] Awesome. All right. So thank you so much. I hope you learned a ton cause I did it. You said that several times now, so enjoy your week, and we’ll see you in the next episode.

Ending: [00:28:20] Join our Wellness Surge Facebook community so that you can implement what we learned together. I am because you are. Thank you for listening and sharing your precious time with us. If you enjoy the show, then follow us and subscribe on iTunes, YouTube, or any app that carries podcasts. Have an awesome week. Best wishes to see you thrive.